Julia Mossbridge Talks About IONS' New Innovation Lab

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Julia Mossbridge Talks About IONS' New Innovation Lab

Created date

14 September 2015
By the
Communications Team

In this interview, Web Services Coordinator Kerstin Sjoquist talks with Julia Mossbridge, the Director of IONS' new Innovation Lab, on how technology can enhance both scientific research as well as support the transformation of individuals across the globe.


Kerstin Sjoquist: Thank you for joining me today! Can you tell us a little bit about what the Innovation Lab is?

Julia Mossbridge: The world is really focused on technology—at least the developed world—and that's not going away. So if we want to reach people with the messages that IONS has developed over the years, in terms of what our science has discovered and what our education department has put together, we have to actually technologize it. And so the Innovation Lab is about taking what IONS' scientists and IONS' educators know to be true about the world, based on their work, and putting it into an experiential app-based format. With very few exceptions, most of what we are talking about here is putting out apps for smartphones, and having relationships with corporations and other non-profits that can help us scale those up so that it's not just a couple hundred people who are using these apps but thousands, tens-of-thousands, and hopefully millions, who are having the experience of personal transformation, self-transcendence, experience of their own consciousness, and sometimes their unconscious processes as well.

The other piece of the Innovation Lab (and as a scientist what I find really exciting) is that each of the technologies that we put out there are going to provide a data stream for IONS' scientists to work on. Can you imagine? You've got a million people recording their dreams in a particular context; you can look for all sorts of things. So any situation where there's lots of data coming in, a chance to put these ideas out in the world, and a chance for IONS to partner with a bunch of different organizations, seems really exciting to me. So that's what the Innovation Lab is about.

KS: Is there a specific "dream" project that you can talk about? A way you might put this application into the world?

JM: I brought up dreams because dreams are actually what got me involved in science. Every since I was a kid I've had precognitive dreams that were very specific, and I started recording them in in my dream journal because I was a little scientist and I had to make sure I wasn't making it up after something would happen. So I could look back and actually see what my dream was. And so I've always had the fantasy, since I was about seven, of some kind of way that people could record their dreams, and those who had precognitive dreams over time could “mark” them. So then those particular markers could be stored, and then we could predict actual events that could be life changing.

So that's one project that I'd really like to work on, and it's related to Dean Radin's Gaia project, which was about getting dreams from a bunch of people. But that [research] never became a smartphone app. So, what if you put your dreams out there every day as a habit, and you have an agreement that IONS' scientists would use a computer algorithm to pair you with someone else who's having similar dreams. So you actually get introduced to someone who has dreams similar to yours; you'd have something to talk about right away, right?

KS: You touched on this briefly, but maybe you could tell us a little bit more about why you in particular are heading up the Innovation Lab?

JM: Partly because I've wanted to, and I do enjoy manifesting things that I want to do! And the other reason is sort of a more linear reason. Cassandra Vieten, the President and CEO of IONS knew me for years, and we've been talking for years about my research. And then I built an application for people to make better life decisions, a smartphone app called Choice Compass. So it's a compass for your choices, and it can measure your heart rhythm with your finger on the camera lens, and the changes in the amount of red in your skin over time as received by the camera can be extrapolated and turned into a heart rhythm. Because as your heart beats there is a different amount of blood, which means a different amount of red over time. And so you think about a choice, and your heart beats in a certain way, and then you think about another choice, and your heart beats in a certain way.

For example: Should I go to Ireland or should I go to New Zealand (let's say you are lucky enough to have that choice)? Your heart's beating in two different ways, and those ways can actually be correlated with hundreds of tests that we've done with participants around the world, who actually have different heart rhythms when they are thinking about obviously good or obviously bad choices. And so it can then tell you which choice is most similar to the heart rhythm for a joyful choice. And so that intrigued Cassi, and I think that's why she wanted me to head the Innovation Lab, just because i have ideas like that, that tend to join the inner and the outer worlds. So give people insight into what's going on inside of them in a way that's very scientifically sound. That's what noetic knowledge or noetic wisdom is all about.

KS: Can you tell us a little bit about the impact that you'd like the Innovation Lab to have on the world? Let's envision a few years years down the road. What would it look like?

JM: Ideally the Innovation Lab wouldn't even be necessary if we want to think really big. Because people would have thrown away their apps because they don't need to be told how to have an experiential state of self-transcendence, or a transformative experience, or a connection with other people or other beings. They don't need that. But that's not where we are [at this time]. So, let's scale back a little and say in five or ten years I would like it to be that more people are performing or experiencing self-transcendent practices.

So by “more” I mean I would like to first measure the number of people in the developed world who are spending a certain amount of their time doing self-transcendent practices (by which I mean any practice that connects you with something that's bigger than yourself), and I would like to double that in the next five years using Innovation Lab technology. And then double it again over the next five years. Because what we know from IONS' research, is that when people perform self-transcendent practices they actually benefit in not just their need for self-transcendence, but in their need for self-actualization, in their physical health, in their feelings of safety… in all of the needs that people think of as sort of being lower level needs than self-transcendence, but those things sort of get boot strapped as well. So we could then have essentially a situation where people are connected with their bodies, connected with their inner wisdom, and using that to go help people in the world.

KS: That's incredibly exciting and I hope I get a chance to check back with you in five years and see how exceptionally well you are doing!

JM: It's IONS that will be doing well if that happens!
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